Next generation of e-learning: making corporate learning personal



well it's ten o'clock in the UK time to start the first of our two learning and skills group webinars today this is Don Taylor speaking from the learning skills group i'm your moderator today and we have with us of course also charles gold of bright wave who will be talking today taking us through how to make corporate learning personal in fact the title has changed but that's the title we started off with the context and the content is the same it's about charles are we talking about something i first learned about from bright wave just before the summer tan event they ran in scotland and i have to say it really chimed with one of the issues i've got around to move towards a more fractured mode of learning where we have resources rather than courses and what nurse we do about that if we're delivering corporate learning well i won't try to steal Charles's some not that i could i'll leave it to him to deliver on what actually that means and go to into that in more detail first let me as always take you through some housekeeping so that um sorry I've you've got a slight spat going on about ethics in the chat area I'll go through some housekeeping as always there are always new people on the call and of course we are trying a new at all today Adobe Connect rather than web links which we've used for a few years and so probably everyone needs to listen in although actually the format will be the same it will be slides presentation and lots of check let's get through the housekeeping then we can move on to Charles first off very importantly a thank you to our sponsors who make all these webinars possible all 16 of them so we are bright wave of course in pole position in the top left-hand corner thanks to them and to all of our sponsors for making the LSG webinar series possible the question which we're always asked is will there be the slides available after the answer is yes the slides the recording the chat will all be available afterwards at learning and skill scribd.com it is a member organization but it's free and there's nothing to jump through you just have to sign up as you can see on the right-hand side they click on the sign up button of your life member you can join the 5,000 people who are already members found will come through a headset or through your computer speakers if there's an issue with that if you can't do some reason then we've got darling details and as always I will drop those darling details into the text chat area if you need them during the course of the presentation and there we are we've got the chat chats very simple clearly everyone knows how to do it without any training at all it's entirely obvious isn't it you type your answer it subscribe your answer here and we hit the battling and you're off and running okay that's very straightforward isn't it only at all of training in life was that simple if you're enjoying what you're seeing and you like what Charles called a bright wave is saying then please do let the world know about it on Twitter lights the hashtag hash LSG webinar that's probably enough for meet now if there is a bit of background noise who I can innocent some other voices in the background so if it's an open-plan office you're listening on them please do mute your phone if is that it's new too so we can't hear it if you're dialing in but it shouldn't be coming through but it might be so please if you are dialing in than mute your phone that's enough for me I think time to move over to our speak today Charles gold or bright flavors going to talk us through and not the rather roughly type I gave earlier but a far puncture one which is next generation you're learning from Charles gold managing director of lightwave and alex ruiz are blended learning can cycle it's learning consultant at right way Charles of Alex over to you good morning thanks done great to see so many people joining I think we're over there after 130 mark which is considerably more than I had listening to me yesterday at the world of learning conference so well done to the LSG to get so many people interested in the in this webinar so yes I'm Charles Gould and managing director of bright wave and I'm joined by a colleague of mine Alex serene and as Don says I'm sorry go ahead and say hello everyone Alec fear so yeah Don said we've adapted the title is little bit although certainly cover many of the things that were billed and it's a somewhat grand title next generation he learn fairly Boulder way of starting off the presentation but where nothing is not full word thinking he replied wave and in all seriousness there are I think some very important trends and issues that i would like to raise with you discuss and then lead into some examples so if i just some quick have an agenda down what going to be an agenda i don't know where that slides flipped off to but um yeah over the next 45 to 60 minutes we'll be talking through some of the things that we see happening in our in our work some of the trends that are going on and influencing not just the work that we're doing now but the way that we provide at them our services to our back to the future and will be touching on three or four case studies from companies such as being teased blooper lloyds banking group sky and then a little bit more depth around somewhere that we've been doing with heineken recently so let me just start and i'll throw open a question to everybody here and in fact that you could type your thoughts and deliver in response to this question into the into the chat box what are some of the common objections that you or other people typically have to conventional elearning crosses there we got boring lack of engagement unacceptable for you to experience not personalized dull to junior this one yeah boring things be coming up quite a lot gosh thank you for bringing it back unlike Andrew hides alleged lack of interactivity I think that back covers in four words a lot of the responsible after you learning yeah I think that's not a bad way of putting it because of course you can't get very well designed elearning that particular purpose even if it is relatively linear but i think what what we do see all too often is yeah a lot of the things that have been mentioned as mentally learning is boring that can be irrelevant in too long it can force people through things that pat they already know or just don't seem to be of any of any use to them can be inaccessible and yeah perhaps because it's frozen in time it's a it's too too often left unloved untended to and I think these these really pose and challenges are for companies like us and I think for many of the people here on live on the on the webinar we've had several years of this this is not new people are continuously saying the same sorts of things about you learning and I fear that there are there is a divergence between what the question in their lives and what they're actually providing them with at work in terms of e-learning so again a rather bold heading but I think our job and learning professionals and learning development professionals is to really consider some of these questions you know how can we use this that vast array of tools and content that are freely often freely available how can we bridge the gap between formal and informal learning how can we deliver more for less and there's not just more for less money but making many people's time being more precise about what we are offering and that most importantly how do people learn differently now because of the ubiquity of broadband there's a massive use of social media ubiquity of mobile devices and apps and so on and I think you know it's our responsibility to really be thinking hard about how people are learning outside work I talked about the vast array of of content a lot of that is user-generated so every minute I mean it may not surprise you these vast numbers because we hear about them all of the time but just look at how much data and information is being created every minute and this is all content that if it is free but how an ask you however after you organize and manage that content make it useful to you I've got a a thought here which I like this to share with you and represented by this diagram but I'm going to build up and it really is that we've seen over the last few years a real convergence in the way that we learn between work and life and I think that could be represented by and something that would which would have happened a decade or more ago where most training happen dinner you know in a block of time after a residential cause we then moved increasingly into training that was happening at work perhaps in shorter spaces of time when we when we have started to it will see the emergence of a good quality CDT that became an opportunity for people to spend time on their own at their own time our own place working through self-paced content then with multimedia online learning we've seen new channels of new media enriching blend of learning I think what we we're seeing is is that that convergence is in sort of reaching a an inevitable conclusion with whether whether we'd like to describe as a mosaic approach and what that means really is that we're so we're so used to blending our work and life learning together that actually it's increasingly into work and Soviet you know for example you'd be I would imagine a lot of people here would think nothing of checking something on YouTube or Google gift of over breakfast in advance of a meeting that they may have that day or when they're at work sharing some information on the social media site within their organization or on the way home on the train will you the five minute piece of content on their mobile device really very much becoming more and more woven into into work better and we we think that we have to recognize that we have to respond to those those those ever increasing trends so I'd wonder if that's another question to throw out to you which is what what learning technology trends have thought your reason imagine and perhaps that you're thinking hard about using for one eye on explains I don't Taylor and Charles Koch so we've got them yet mobile coming up in Miami deeper gamification is coming up in several phones and computer capturing people's imagination at the moment social learning mobile bull move to html5 yeah so lots of lots of different ideas around mobile orifice around socialist countries like Heidi's mentioned the duration which will come back to so yeah I think you know this diagram shows you some of these that we now have thought about killing Kate I think that's what we should regard them I have plumbing variety of different devices welcome to live online training the protector of different media file formats that are available and of course social meeting as well I'm sorry guy to hold you off for a second though because we got some comments in the area that we can hear background noise from people um it's not mother written here but some people can so if you're dialing in please do remember to mute I think yeah I don't think it's nothing very many people doing it but I was happening with a couple of people so please yeah if you're pedalling in it should automatically knew but it's doesn't you're doing it so please just run to meet yourselves okay guys Charles Malik's back to you yeah so about that if there is some background noise but yet please could you meet your phones to prevent that what we shown here is really a conceptual model of weird calling mosaic learning and I'd like to introduce some of these elements to you that half over to to Alex to just talk you through some of these concepts which are deliberately in response to some of the things that we've been seeing and that you've just mentioned around friends in learning technologies Alex I felt it over tea so yeah as we've discussed I mean there are lots of exciting new technologies out there but we've been doing some thinking about how we can harness the power of those technologies and one application is in the corporate learning world is using the use of learning portals like the example shown here which aggregates a number of different technologies so here we have featured content which could consist of from good quality videos elearning courses and user-generated and all of which can be rated and reviewed by learners so you can start to see we know what is the most popular and useful content available we also look at using some gamification techniques like leaderboards which help to encourage some friendly competition and celebrate success for people doing well in particular learning games quizzes and assessments and we also have the opportunity to draw in life online learning so have a space where people can access all their scheduled webinars and virtual classrooms and also as people discussing earlier bringing in the social elements of learning so having live Twitter feed on particular learning campaigns and of course quizzes and assessments are still a core part of any learning interventions would expect to see that and in the portals we're producing and of course some the curation the cherry picking of really good existing resources both on company intranet and externally on the internet and here we have our directories of learning which could be both elearning and access to classroom courses so it's with you know drawing together the best blend of online and offline learning and also the opportunity to post questions to experts within the organization they're just really set that the feel for the kind of the box of tricks we have disposal now and Charles will start talking about some of the practical application of these in some of the real work we've been doing yeah so that if you like a conceptual model which harnesses content both designs and curate social media and gamification as well as live online social learning let's just look at a few examples this in practice and one of these as one of the first and women perhaps argue pioneering example of a portal like this is something that we work with for Sky this is a an onboarding portal for all new join the team who joined sky there yet there are act able to access this portal and if we look at it in a little bit more detail it can it combines a range of things such as interactive games if I just hover over that this image is a little bit fuzzy just because we've sir we've done using dinner or zoomed out of it so you could be we've got a range of different things such as video assets this guy can control them and edit and manage some specific module to be learning we have some social media areas down here games and a leaderboard as well and this is the interesting thing about voters of it it's being kept alive when the fresh by Sky all of the time and that's important because people do you think of it as something that's dynamic and very relevant it also has some personal components so it shows you precisely where you are and what you've got to do it also has a countdown I think it's a show you here countdown to win when you're going to join in terms of those days hours and even minutes before your start date and you know the results are impressive over the last three years if you can see there have been significant savings and and people continue to 15 instance so that is that encompass just some of the public types of things that we've been talking about more recently we've worked with bucher on a similar similar initiative and this time we designed something that has been deployed both on computers pcs and also iPad has been designed both using an html5 and again it uses a range of this components so I just move through here so we've got some Michael essential modules that people really need to be able to go through and then some options to go deeper into extra resources we've got user-generated content very simple piece of the video that has been produced at little or no cost to really give people a sense of of the organization and then we've spent the budget if you like really focus that on some high quality interactive e-learning we haven't tried to simply repurpose a vast amount of information that already exists in a perfectly decent format instead we've we've really gone about organizing that freely and readily available information and content in a sensible way and then focusing in on the key messages to put the real sort of design effort into such as it such as in this sort of example here and in this time we focused on the not so much on the business results but on the on the learners response to to this which you can see has been very positive and and in particular just give the level of engagement in relevance that they've been found let's move on now and I'll hand over to alex's to talk to you a couple of other examples okay so um Lloyd ocean group came to us because they want to convert a 20-day face-to-face induction program for their telephony staff and so much shorter and sharper blended learning solution and they were looking for an experience that would really motivate their new starters many of whom school leavers with little or no understanding of the banking industry they wanted something that was very engaging easy to understand and not your traditional quick next to contain you've kind of e-learning so this particular course we took the concepts of the learning journey to its logical conclusion so we take learners on a road trip around loads UK sites and here you can see dawn our virtual trainer in the driving seat who guides learners through the learning experience and research shows that we tend to process information more deeply when it's presented by a guy part2 like this which makes a lot of sense as you know throughout human history we tended to learn from other people whether parents teachers trainers or mentors now this program comprises over 26 hours of learning and when you're feeling with that kind of volume of content it's really important to have a lively and varied mix of media to hold people's attention so here we have you know presenter led videos with Dorner our virtual trainer we also have dramatizations of work based scenarios so you know this is really good for accelerating people's competence by showing them demonstrations of good practice and also things to avoid and again these techniques are based on our understanding of the latest research into learning which shows that people tend to remember that's much more easily when they're presented in the context of stories rather than just list of bullet points and we also have colleagues testimonials so again drawing on that kind of YouTube approach to learning where you capture best practice from experts within the organization and of course the loyal F&E staff learning about lloyds banking applications is a really critical part of the job so we used Asima technology on this one's create systems simulations and guided factors ok we'll now move on to some of the very latest work we've done with heineken which is just going live this week i believe so this is really hot off the press and now heineken they had a really strong business case for refreshing and revitalizing their training for sales staff as they done them some annual selling skills assessment and found that the failure rates are unacceptably high higher than the industry standard that they came to us to the looker how we could make the induction process much more engaging and high-impact so this particular lens uses a mixture a very traditional and very contemporary instructional approaches so you'll see we have an induction workbooks which you'd get on your first day of employment obviously a very familiar but you know still very effective training and orientation tool we also have developed for heineken a physical paper board game heineken experts which is a kind of trivial pursuit on all things Heineken and this is great for a sales staff they tend to be on the road a lot on their own but who get together for monthly meetings and briefings to help build up their products and brand knowledge in a really fun and sociable way we also have here a capability map which outlines learning pathways that heineken using the seventy 2010 model and finally we have another learning portal which features a digital version of the board game plus lots of really great existing resources from within Heinekens intranet and externally which the heineken team of cherry picked for this particular induction learning campaign now we'll have a closer look at portal we've developed for heineken so here you can see you've got access to the online gain we have a leaderboard which shows the top scoring learners in the game and heineken are really going to incentivize usage by awarding monthly prizes for the learners who are doing best in the game adds an extra element of fun to the whole proceedings and then here we have the learning pathways you can go through to access the wealth of existing recalled resources that Heineken has we also have nice little features like favorites and history so that as you're navigating your way through all this content you can favorite it and also you can rate and review it as you go along so your peers can see what's the most popular content on sorry we just have a look at some of the online quiz game now you have to use your imagination here as we've only got screen shot today but in the real thing it's all very nicely animated with cards flipping up and do select each category and spinning bottles so you can select questions from all the categories we have here like selling skills and your brand knowledge or you can decide to spin the bottle for a random realm which select 10 questions from all categories so if you did that you have the card slipping up the question and I I don't know if we have any cider drinkers on the line today because anyone know what color is the bottle of almonds original yes those of you answered Brown I believe oh right oh yeah they took too many teenage years spent in bus stops obviously yeah let's move on if you selected clear you'd have been wrong I'm afraid so yeah it's a simple multiple-choice question quiz but with a bit of added element of fun and tension with a countdown so your timed as you're doing it and you get bonus points if you do it within time etc and we'll just skip ahead to see a game feedback screen again some of those education techniques rather familiar with where you have you know gold stars flashing up on the screen so again add a little bit of fun for the whole learning experience now we'll return to the main portal and just have a little look at experience when you go into these learning pathways which curated by the heineken team so if we decided we wanted to you know go a bit deeper about what information and training is available on closing and handling objections we can go into this area we can also dive in and look at you know what happens in the closing and handling objections workshops we've got a little outline and three face-to-face course and we can directly book ourselves online on slips course that just gives you a snapshot of what we've been doing with heineken in terms of a blend which mixes Oldham you really to give you a feel for where we're going up yeah thanks Alex just picking on I want to a couple of the questions Alan the what you're actually looking at is the front end of of a learning management systems which we which is which is our own learning management system that we licensed to heineken its host is externally which means that they can get access from wherever they can get internet access provided they have obviously the the correct login details but i think what sir you know perhaps worth re-emphasizing is just the UC disappoint which we driving highly made up a success pick that out earlier which is that of curation if I just get back here and the the heineken team are all actively and continuously adding to this they're adding content they're recognizing when people have favorited certain aspects of the learning so that they can focus in on perhaps providing more of that so they're responding to the way that users are actually engaging and interacting with this learning portal and so you can see for example I'm it may not come across very clearly but there are various activities as well as content there are going back to their their chosen 17 2010 model there are things that people can do on the job so while they're working those though expected to undertake experiences that will help them become commercially more aware and able to sell Heineken better and then there are opportunities to people to interact with each other in a more informal way so this really does provide a platform for a lot of the things that we were taught about the beginning of the presentation there for things like that the social element clearly but not just in terms of discussion forums very much being able to interact with people informally away from from the online forums and also of course does that ever have that element of competition by seeing you can get highest up the leaderboard you want to have something else yeah I just don't pick you up on some of the technical questions I've noticed in the chat area where Famer I mean this portal and all the portals we've shown so far today are built using right ways launch and track technology however these portals can be launched from bigger learning management systems with the data that's trapped here passed back to it bigger lms so and it's also work just saying that this platform is of itself gone compliant so all the tanks with is captured to that standard so I think we'll just try and sort of draw these threads back together again so we mostly looked at some of the trends are influencing our thinking some of the things which increasingly we can't avoid or escape that are happening in our recreational lives that are then being brought to work so mobile and social and then we've looked at some specific examples that highlight some of those things culminating in in heinekens very much curated content approach so like to really just sort of draw those together and consider again what might the future of online learning looks like well you certainly think that it should incorporate dynamic and user-generated content so rather than a course being created in a him and then launched and never touched becoming increasingly irrelevant over time we should really be looking to have that you use the technology uses with social media and online technology better to make sure that learning is amiss kept alive and we should be recognizing the demand for webinar and virtual classroom based training so offering people that live experience that we've got right now where people can interact with the facilitator but also appears that there can be done live and then taken offline later on as well talk a little bit about gamification as well as storytelling competition and gaming are very powerful ways of engaging not just engaging people but helping them focus in on problem-solving which is a wonderful way of really engaging the brain interesting being able to help people learn to keep keeping and key elements that will help helping solve problems and then yeah as we said how do you draw together in a relevant way for your audiences of learners content that really is going to help them have you cut through the noise as you make the most of what's freely available we happen to believe that that one of the key skills that is emerging is that of being able to research properly but it's something that if I can see from my own children as a vibe and struggle with their homework is not an easy thing to do and the temp focusing on the top two or three links of a google search which isn't always the best for content and relevance so there's a real opportunity to grapple with this issue of content curation making freely available content relevant and that could be both externally on the Internet at large but of course also within your own organization that's bound to be a lot of very valuable knowledge and and content that can be curated and may made available and relevant to for a particular subject and the particular group of people but of course with that content comes in to be able to guide people through it and navigate so one think you're aging and gathering relevant content it's another them to help people really see where they should be going with that so the finer can look at the the reap map based on the sort of London Underground idea and you know that's about a good example of really providing people with lots of content of the sources but then helping them to direct their learning talks about social learning we've also talked about the importance of focusing in on the real high impact content where the messages are really important that everyone needs to be aware of so that might be some you know nice nicely produced video dramas it could be some high-impact animations of very interactively done so there's still a place the well design has what we might consider to be more conventionally learning here but it's not a case of simply repurposing vast amounts of you know powerpoint slides and and trying to sort of make those go online and without really adding a lot to them and we actually think that all this ought to be focused in on the real performance objectives that you have when you're working with you you learn it's all very well providing people with lots of resources the ability to interact with with with one another games and stories but there have to be a real business purpose we're going to the best time and money into it into these things so why not really maybe the assessment if you like it may be that we don't use that particular word but the proof that you really have got a capability built why don't you make that be the real focus in a way don't worry about how people have got there but ensure that they they have actually made it there and so you know I'm sure we've all seen this sort of rather tokenistic 10 multiple-choice questions at the end of a of an e-learning course that frankly it have been fairly rushed together and they're easy to easy to answer well that really adds nothing in my view I think we really need to to use assessment to focus people's performance and and focusing on the change that we want people to to be able to demonstrate and then finally something that we're increasingly interested in is what we call that learning analytics sounds rather technical thing but it's what is what it actually is about making more of the data that is captured through learning management systems about how people are using learning and how they're interacting with one another and with content so for example we may have found recently that went with one client we were able to see that 2,000 people have registered on an online portal and but only 52 percent of that had actually accessed the content but of those people something like eighty percent have worked their way through and completed a tough assessment so what does that tell us well it it tells us that there's an issue about encouraging people to to actually be motivated to go to the two little early but once they're there the the content and the experience has been effective another example could be that we find a percentage of people that have struggled technically to access the portal and so there are various things that can be used to improve the learning experience and in the case of people like heineken you know they were actively responding to an analysis of their their audience and how they're interacting with with the learning portal and so it's really about making more of the data that it's becoming more and more available in terms of how people use these experiences and providing some analysis of that there is no shortage as we know of data about how many people have gone through a test how many people have completed of course and so on but what do you do with that and how do you then use that to improve the whole experience so finally I'd like to you know just sort of consider what that really will mean in terms of the benefits for e-learning and online that's learning in future quite quite a few simple things really I think that we're going to see more focus on on performance and change through that sort of real focus on assessments and less time wasted for learner to already can do things more use of what's already available and less spent on repurposing content and more precision running that for keeping and less noise and developments that's a real challenge of course when we look at that vast amount of content and that's where again I think that could be a key issue accusations navigation through content resorted and focusing in on a real objective that the learner needs to achieve through a gradual assessment those of those other things that really matter so unless I just sort of now perhaps with Don's he'll pick up on some of the questions and comments that we've seen and just forget people's views about some of the things that we've shown and Wow let's have a look through Charles great job don't worry about section yourself at I've been struggling a bit to serve through the questions here and keep up with them some super questions answered observations thought discussions well I've also historically qualifications are very new what did Roman aqueduct builders due to the 2,000 plus here at legacy the answer it's cuz they had apprenticeships but of course apprenticeships that did have a non qualification strategy but a very formal structure of indenture a fixed time and at the end of it you did have your articles which you only got if the master thought they were up to scratch so I guess you could say that was a qualification that's by the by I think we can talk about our qualifications as being accurate as a measure of competence until the cows come home let's come back to some of the questions we had childhood we did have an awful lot I'm just picking out one very cold is raid which is them about 50 question is it is unstructured well that's a bleep on James Farrow came up with is it is though dangerously unstructured viv mark hide your pitch them but with the different opinion it's an interesting discussion at it can it be to unstructured is that necessarily a bad thing Charles yeah I mean that that's a really interesting question I think there are a few way to laughter I mean one is that people are used to unstructured you know they use their increasing in use to multiple ways of interacting with content with the people on you know with other people online with knowledge and information but I think that there is a risk of assuming that people can find their own pathways through efficiently so you know there is there is a have I said about my children doing their homework you can spend an awful lot of time trying to research and not necessarily coming up with the best answers that's where the busy that issue of curation and navigation comes in so there is a role that someone to play in my view to help them assist people through some in a really good valuable and dynamic information and content yeah I think what you know this question is a good one and and in the other people who have subject in there and a lot of it is around the context if you've got a participated audience who are used to being able to you've got good research skills then perhaps on lack of structure is is a good thing but in our view that you can even get a good balance by using curation and navigation and assessment just to think what you thought the assessments is is really important because if you are giving people a more kind of open-ended way of accessing learning you want to be sure they have understood the key points and that's why not just having a very simple multiple-choice question ends which you know traditionally been too easy to cheat your way through and actually looking at spending time and effort in developing me you know real really challenging job simulations which really test understanding and application of knowledge is really important an increasingly important part of this kind of blend I can see this conversation carrying on mark no missing from hundred and Steve they've been talking about this structure issue i think there's also a point to be made about the going back to the purpose if we're talking about some very serious compliance procedures and policies then arguably there is only one right way to do something and therefore a highly structured approach and possibly a linear approaches is called for where it actually if if you're talking about slightly less specific or mandatory performance then yeah i think people should be enabled to find their own place who learning so that actually works for them and isn't isn't irrelevant and is making efficient use of their own types of people you know people people don't want to be pushed through screen after screen of information that they are they're engaging or rimmel events do they really know it so you know I think it's also support is really and it's also about the level of learning learners understandings though for novice learners actually very structured approaches are quite appropriate because if you're in a position you know you don't know what you don't know if it's quite good to be handheld through but for more sophisticated experienced learners of a subject you might want to give them more opportunities to you know define their own learning pathways yeah and I'm JP is making the similar points to the one I made about compliance training where it is happening regulated yeah it probably needs to be more more structured okay that's but there are plenty more questions when the structure questions of important while it's not another day yeah I've got I've got plenty more to pull out though I do as it goes on my pull out questions and yeah and this prevents people ask questions early on being forgotten like Luke on the heineken question a number of people came up with the same question it in different ways asked how did you structure the 70 in 70 2010 model always a key question isn't it so what to do there well it's very much the heineken team identifying things that their their team can be doing on the job and at work that will help their performance bear in mind that this was designed many for with you telling you join us in mind we're a combination any way of learning on the soft interact so for the fact that I'm noise / guys but then all it is episode a game trophy on not that yeah so it really reflects how they skilled in their team anyway yup and have done for music for some time and then really try to organize organize that through the through the portal so if we had more time to show you though we could show you that the crowd lot of links or resources that help people learn on the job as well as things that they can take more formally but it was really you know we acted as the enablers for heineken to to build that 70 2010 mother which is one that they chose incidentally I think um you know there are there's a whole interesting debate about the validity of that 70 2010 model but we were certainly happy to work with heineken on the patient of it so just a quick recap from seven to twenty ten for people but it is a description rather than a I rule this yeah just to be clear there's a lot of flack flying around about Center 2010 saying you have to have sent representatives twenty percent of this and ten percent of formula and it's not the case so let's move on let's talk about gamification and filled raised the point about gamification serious games gamification means having a little bit of dem gaming stuff on top and serious gaming means starting it from the beginning with games in mind I'm taking it they're here you mentioned adding gaming elements you're really talking about gamification rather than starting them with a game in mind it is untrue I think we do we've done a mixture of the two I mean gamification as the participants of rightly noted is about of taking little elements of games like leaderboards lights on those competitive and engaging elements and incorporating them in other applications like elearning or or other kinds of websites and systems and and and you're right they aren't the same as serious games where you have you know very immersive environments which are you know fully structured games but vertical yeah pump dirty home from Europe but I get under the advantage of gamification is you can use some of those engagement approaches quite cost-effectively in a way that really does grab people's attention learn guess you're right then it's not the same as a full serious ok ok don't backed into to some other questions that came up a chris lewis with cooper to through on this idea of gamification said how do we make and I don't user-generated content after those a bit of discussion about that but at firstly how do we make game aside content dynamic and user-generated because if you're if you're using a game then you're defining in the beginning what the structure is a much of the content so how do you bridge the gap between the game and the idea of user-generated content and making it less structured or have I got is a no paradox go at all I think here we were seeing them as these are all different elements that we could draw on and some of them are quite separate so yeah you're right with a game it does take a lot of thinking through all the elements of the game and it is a very quite a structured learning experience and user-generated content is another part of the power of technologies we we have available I guess what we're seeing in this mix of the kind of do it yourself user-generated content the duration of existing resources online is what that gives you an opportunity for is to look at where you want to concentrate your budget so rather than spending money in developing huge courses which are regurgitating content that's already out there or can be supplied by your community for free you're probably best off thinking about you know ending your money on quality rather than quantity and that might be looking at will let's have some verified learning approach is awesome really yeah John job simulations and assessment so we got no background voice I don't know where they're coming from please if your darling in please do boot yourselves on mute I'm taking so thanks for answer Alex moving on to this this idea then of of the involvement of people with generating content I'm trying to catch you can tell crack through some some questions we've got I I think with Jason just raise a point it says no jump and Vernon in relation to user generated content whilst valuable and laudable I question how many or what percentage of a population can or want to contribute and to what degree they do do is it an art to extract or generate user generated content others question of how we can get user generated content in the first place and also we have a question raised by Steven and Sheila as to what exactly the boundaries are without being too semantic where user-generated content and working with an M and working with an SME begin do you have any thoughts about that in general in terms of this because obviously if you've got a mosaic approach I'm guessing a lot of the stuff you're working with will be ugc any thoughts on that yeah I mean I think cared for the tackle the first point yeah they're obviously there is always a sensitive people who are willing to share their thoughts and put those thoughts into into content in whatever that form may take but we're all very now becoming very used to things like raping of you know videos on YouTube or we go to tripadvisor we can we can sort of filter through to the most popular content or most popular comment and I don't see why that shouldn't be any different for learning content that we use at work so if we so again looking at the heineken example there was an opportunity to like particular element and and and in depression we could focus that a little bit more into how useful was that to you and we again we see this in all sorts of other media so that that correctly you know I think they're I don't think we should shy away from from enabling people to share their their views on their content and if you have ways of them and ensuring that the the cream rises to the top then I think that's all the better as Charles says critical thinking needs to be applied on ugc user-generated content as production as well as consumption user ratings help of course at them and I think that's a really good point by the way Mike towels is a mark too nervous it would be great to connect what's your email address you can by all means share it here if you want to or if you prefer you could probably do it through the loading of skills group where you don't have to share it with everybody else and yes we've got Sally and a bunch of other people saying too much background noise believing you to all what we we have gotten you too long I don't quite understand why this is happening anyway let's move on but we have probably time for one more question so let me let me find the one more question I'm sorry I did said a lot of people yes I'll raise that excellent point at the end and yes we've run out of time as we tend these because we've got smart people way come up with good questions this question I'd like to ask about video and cost because we had two different sides of this we had one point which is the video is expensive and it's going to be difficult no matter how the drama might be it can be aspects pensive jonathan said to produce quality video but an allen said I think technology allows us to make video quicker and more real than ever so who's right or are they both right in some way Charles I know you used to offer video notes wine that's why I'm quite keen on getting this question answered yeah i mean i look at this is a spectrum from and it's all relevant it's all it's all valid so yeah some video can be free can't a lot of people get little or no and it's useful and relevant so that might be some talking heads some sort of very simple YouTube style how-to guide but equally there's a place for really well honed well-designed video especially when we're talking about drama so in the lloyds example we deliver there was a serious budget for very good quality video but yeah I think it's people sometimes automatically assume that videos is a more cost more costly option but it doesn't always have to be I mean recently we've done some work with a client where we recorded their subject expert talking through some PowerPoint slides and brought this to life by animating some of the slides and his techno in sync with with his narration and so we did a one day shoot and then a couple of days edit so we had 30 minutes of really good quality video produced you know very cost-effectively I mean I mean certainly cheaper than an equivalent 30 minutes of e-learning sailor in terms of the production time to shoot and edit video it does tend to be quite la quicker than say a flash-based or html5-based elearning course and as we've seen from YouTube I mean the appetite people have for watching videos is incredible and now that fortunately in in many I appreciate not all corporate environments you know bandwidth is growing or you're able to host some of your learning content externally then I think the opportunities for video based learning a are going to grow and grow I think Alan Browns have made a good point which is yeah i mean what you want to work out how how quickly and often you want to change and if you if you put stuck into expensive video that might be an issue but it's really what you do with that video isn't it I mean you come in early you can make it interactive you can you can break it into small pieces and I'm Jonathan Berman who clearly knows what he's talking about so the cost is now down to the craft skills of writers and directors and Andrew hydrides a very good point good video is expensive sometimes so is bad video because after all all of them is thrown away your money on a lot of tat and okay just sorry I said that was the last question I have a rider question because I did sound again to a certain it was important point my unfortunate let it get lost but Robyn brought it up again accessibility it this is not exclusive to what you've been talking about here today but it is an important issue can this sort of visually rich approach really work for people who are on for example screen readers although visually impaired and by the way in the background i should say i'm also working myself towards ways of making our forums here accessible accessible people especially have hearing difficulties but there's our last question child screen reading screen reading and visually rich material bach me dome I think we're we're firm believers that wherever possible you shouldn't take a one-size-fits-all approach you you want to create the best learning experience you can for the particular groups so I think rather than compromising on some of the visual richness which are going to be very important for some users in an ideal world you wanted to optimize learning experience for different types of users and personalize the learning experience and you see that now across websites you can personalize the site to your requirements and preferences and and where idea allows which be was preferred to to recommend that for e-learning experiences as well so you can have a very visually rich course but also have an accessible version to go with it but sometimes of course budgets don't allow that and so you have to look at making some compromises on on both sides to get a solution that that is usable by everyone but usually there's no real excuse for not making you know the bulk of text screen readable and and for tagging images and things like that and we would certainly do that in most cases very good I we are over the hourly which is terrible I'd never do that but but we we have to wrap up unfortunately I do apologize because as always with 160 people in the room and we have the peak we have a Trent amount of of comments and really useful stuff and it always kills me enough to wrap it up but people have places to go work to do presentations to right I guess and all that let's just quickly go through to the to the contact details for Brian Webb there we are so if you want to contact the right way guys that's the details and of course this presentation will be recorded and will be available online afterwards at the loading skills group and let me just quickly show you how that all works I have to get back to my backup slides so thank you everyone I must say for you for your participation as well chipping in and also adds a big painted a child's of Alex for everything they've brought to the situation the hashtag for the event is hash LSG webinar if you've enjoyed that please do let the world know about it on Twitter as I say the details the materials are all available through the learning skills group and that's the URL there unsurprisingly it is at the learning and skills group.com and it's free to sign up just put your name in and you're registered and off you go and all our next webinar goodness me it's in 55 minutes UK time ed cowan who despite the photograph it's not a silent movie tap dancer but it's in fact a very smart guy working in the field of the elearning he's going to be talking about the value of high-quality learning content and I think draws on quite nicely from ugc and everything we were talking about just now we'll hear from Ed and his amazing tap-dancing shoes at twelve o'clock UK time that's in about 55 minutes once again thanks everyone on the call for your participation in your thoughts and thanks to Charles and addicts as you can see great plaudit air coming through to you for a great presentation thanks guys

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